Members Login
Username 
 
Password 
    Remember Me  
Post Info TOPIC: SDS protocol


Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 22
Date:
RE: SDS protocol


PetriK wrote:

Thats suzuki, so just look at the factory manual what it says - the Busa interface should be a direct fit.

http://ecuhacking.activeboard.com/forum.spark?aBID=99460&p=3&topicID=41122594

 

Do you know the output pin of the suzuki ODB  ?

I've reach to get this :

___ ___
|1| |2|
|3| |4| tab
|5| |6|
___ ___


4 pins are populated -
2 - +12V power when ignition is on
3 - connected to serial data pin on ECU
5 - dealer mode
6 - dealer mode

Shorting 5 and 6 puts the bike in dealer mode.

 

thanks




 



__________________
If i can help you...


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 2338
Date:

Yep, it looks similar. Only way to find out is to test with a suzuki interface.


__________________

When asking a question, you can also consider posting it to facebook:

http://www.facebook.com/ecueditorcom



Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 22
Date:

PetriK wrote:

Yep, it looks similar. Only way to find out is to test with a suzuki interface.



When you said "suzuki interface." is about the software or the hardware ?

I friend will send me the official soft from suz ;)

 



__________________
If i can help you...


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 2338
Date:


ecueditor.com uses suzuki sds protocol to read the gaugedata and errorcodes. you can download the software at http://www.ecueditor.com. To use that software you need an interface to connect to your ecu/bike. Using the software go to get interface form ebay for options you have. I can not quarantee that this works with your bike, but you could try to locate someone close to you who has an interface.





__________________

When asking a question, you can also consider posting it to facebook:

http://www.facebook.com/ecueditorcom



Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 22
Date:

PetriK wrote:


ecueditor.com uses suzuki sds protocol to read the gaugedata and errorcodes. you can download the software at http://www.ecueditor.com. To use that software you need an interface to connect to your ecu/bike. Using the software go to get interface form ebay for options you have. I can not quarantee that this works with your bike, but you could try to locate someone close to you who has an interface.

I've dowloaded your program yesterday, i'll buy a interface.




 



__________________
If i can help you...


Newbie

Status: Offline
Posts: 1
Date:

how to analyze this data packet?

Here is data packet received from vehicle, but I do not know how to analyze. Could anybody help me?


TX: 82 10 F1 21 25
RX: 95 F1 10 61 81 00 7E FF 9C 00 00 02 00 23 6D 6D 5B 5B A5 00 00 31 00 6D 89

TX: 82 10 F1 21 84 28
RX: 99 F1 10 61 84 00 7D FF 9C 02 00 23 6A 6A 5D 5D A5 00 00 32 00 00 00 00 00 00 6D 4A D8

Thanks very much for your help.

-- Edited by omid_ele on Wednesday 16th of February 2011 10:40:44 PM

__________________


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 2338
Date:

Just read the documents earlier in this thread about kwp protocol and those will tell you what packets and for what purpose.


__________________

When asking a question, you can also consider posting it to facebook:

http://www.facebook.com/ecueditorcom



Veteran Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 26
Date:

dear friends
I am interested to SDS for my suzuki dl 650 v-strom (tps,o2 sensor,iat,iap value...)
you can explain in easy terms what is required to sds?

software: ecueditor 2.5
hardware:USB 2.0 To RS232 TTL Module Converter PL2303 (3-5 volt) or USB to TTL Converter with FDTI chip?

diagram:

Sds connector>>>>>>module converter>>>>>>>>computer

I forget other things?

excuse me for English

hi maurice from Italy

__________________


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 963
Date:

The SDS is a 12 volt signal. TTL is a 5V signal. You will need a circuit like the one shown on the very first page of this thread to convert the signal levels.

Do you have any electronics experience?

__________________


Veteran Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 26
Date:

thanks

electronics basic experience :)

Diagram:

 

sds connector>>>>circuit page 1 or page 3?>>>>module converter>>>>usb port computer

 

alternative:

http://www.healtech-electronics.com/   obd tool  no



-- Edited by dl650vstrom on Wednesday 22nd of June 2011 04:29:58 PM

__________________


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 963
Date:

The one on page 3 is TTL to SDS. The one on page 1 is RS232 to SDS.



__________________


Veteran Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 26
Date:

RidgeRacer wrote:

The one on page 3 is TTL to SDS. The one on page 1 is RS232 to SDS.


 I do not understand the difference between TTL and RS232

i want connect sds connector motorcycle to usb port notebook



__________________


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 963
Date:

The problem is that Registered Standard 232 (RS232) is both a Logical standard and a Physical standard.

The logical part describes how the data is formatted and transmitted and has to do with baud rates, stop, start, and parity bits

The physical part describes the electronic hardware requirements. True RS232 operates at +12V and -12V.

TTL is a physical standard that operates at 0-5V.

The logical RS232 is very popular but the fact it requires a dual voltage power supply makes the interface circuit complicated. For that reason many Micro Controller Units (MCU) that include built in serial communications hardware provides the logical part but outputs the signals at TTL levels and requires you to provide the physical interface circuits.

This is referred to as 232 TTL. 232 Logic at TTL voltages.

The USB converter module you mention converts USB data into RS232 formatted data at TTL voltages.

The circuit on Page 3 converts the TTL voltages to the 0-12V signals required by the SDS.



__________________


Veteran Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 26
Date:

I have difficulty in Italy 'to buy FDTI TTL 232R

There are problems using USB to serial adapter PL2303 TTL
for example

http://cgi.ebay.it/USB-to-serial-adapter-PL2303-TTL-console-Recovery-RS232-/260791084683?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_15&hash=item3cb85c268b

 

 

problem number two:

sds connector:

|1| |2|
|3| |4| tab
|5| |6|
___ ___



2 - +12V power when ignition is on
3 - connected to serial data pin on ECU
5 - dealer mode (negative)
6 - dealer mode


question:
where i connect k-line?

pin 3 or pin 6?



-- Edited by dl650vstrom on Friday 24th of June 2011 05:10:02 PM

__________________


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 963
Date:

Most likely pin 3 is the one you want. It should read around 8V-12V with the ignition on. You should also be able to pull the voltage down with a 470 ohm resistor to ground. If pin 3 should NOT read 5V. If it does it is a TTL line.

One of those pins should be a ground, probably pin 5. What are the wire colors? Do you have a link to a .pdf version of the manual?

__________________


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 963
Date:

dl650vstrom wrote:

I have difficulty in Italy 'to buy FDTI TTL 232R

There are problems using USB to serial adapter PL2303 TTL
for example

http://cgi.ebay.it/USB-to-serial-adapter-PL2303-TTL-console-Recovery-RS232-/260791084683?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_15&hash=item3cb85c268b

 


 I didn't see a question mark (?) any where in there. Are you saying you have a problem with this cable or asking if there will be a problem?

Assuming you were asking...

These type of cables operate in two modes.

One mode is as a Virutal COM port where the USB appears to Windows as a standard RS-232 COM port. This allows the cable to be used with any software that can use a standard COM port.

The other mode is a direct driver mode where the software requires specific hardware drivers for each cable.

Physically, Electrically this cable is the same as the FTDI. The question is will it be compatiable with the software you plan on using?

 



__________________


Veteran Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 26
Date:

You're making me struggle with the English language, I forgot the question mark! excuse me
I want to use software ecueditor, is the only one I know.
I do not know sds pinout connector, but color of wire is
|1| |2|
|3| |4| tab
|5| |6|

(1)= empty
2= red (+12v)
3= gray
(4)= empty
5=red/white
6=back/white (GND)

pin5+pin6= dealer mode

Thanks for your cooperation and excuse me for many questions


__________________


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 963
Date:

Number 3 Gray is the SDS serial (K-Line) wire.

__________________


Veteran Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 26
Date:

pin 3 gray (k-line) work ad 7.7-9 volt (only ignition on--- with motor start)
pin 5 red/ white (dealer mode) work 5 volt (ignition on/motor start)





__________________


Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 10
Date:

I am studying data communication in some of my classes at school and this post has enticed me to try to communicate with my Suzuki.  I have a lot of the parts (resistors and transistors) in the schematic floating around the house.  I also have an elm327 USB laying around also, most likely a copy as it was $15 off ebay.  

So... I have read the post over a few times and unsure how this setup is working.  A few posts made it seem like you were just connecting the bike to a simple transistor circuit right to a computer and other posts made it seem like it was connected to an ELM327 OBD2 device before going in to the computer. Is Suzuki actually outputting a variant of ODB2? 



-- Edited by snoop on Saturday 16th of July 2011 02:55:05 PM

__________________


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 963
Date:

As I'm sure you learned in class all protocols have two parts; The physical protocol, voltages, baud rates, timing etc, and a Logical protocol syntax, packet size, checksums etc.

It is physically similar to ODB2. Logically it is a subset of KWP2000



__________________


Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 10
Date:

I keep editing this post because I answering my questions with googling.

Unfortunately my classes are based around the mathematics of it all and nothing with the fun hardware stuff yet.  So i am still a bit confused.

Let me see if I have right... I just built the circuit on page 3 and I have a serial -> usb adapter.  Am I just connecting the Rx, Tx and ground to the usb adapter?  And then the K line, 12v, and ground to the SDS connector?   The main limitation is the intialization that has to be done to wake up the ecu but you guys figured out how to generate it with code on the pc.  So far thats what I understand, please correct me if I mistated the process.  Last question, I don't see that custom baudrate in the official SDS software, does that mean the SDS box is recommunicating at that custom baud rate.

Also, my usb adaptor has a Prolific chip which can support custom baud rates but they have to be programmed onto its chip.  I may be better off just purchasing one that is FTDI based. I also tore apart my elm327 device to also find it has a pic microcontroller in it. So i dont think that would be of any help to me. Ironically it has a FTDI chip on it.  I dont think my soldering skills are good enough to remove it.



-- Edited by snoop on Sunday 17th of July 2011 05:02:06 AM

__________________


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 2338
Date:

Quite recently learned that VAG com interface that has an FTDI chip can also be used as interface to sds protocol (ecueditor.com). Obviously you can not use VAG com interface for reading or writing the ecu.



__________________

When asking a question, you can also consider posting it to facebook:

http://www.facebook.com/ecueditorcom



Veteran Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 26
Date:

PetriK wrote:

Quite recently learned that VAG com interface that has an FTDI chip can also be used as interface to sds protocol (ecueditor.com).


 very interesting,just a few dollar and few connection:12v,gnd,k-line

work in progresswink

Petrik,why do not you compose limited edition ecueditor only for SDS ? smile



-- Edited by dl650vstrom on Saturday 6th of August 2011 07:01:31 AM



-- Edited by dl650vstrom on Sunday 7th of August 2011 07:32:34 AM

__________________


Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 22
Date:

dl650vstrom wrote:

 very interesting,just a few dollar and few connection:12v,gnd,k-line

work in progresswink

Petrik,why do not you compose limited edition ecueditor only for SDS ? smile



 Hello dl650vstrom, If you have reach to make the SDS work with the Vstrom, can you make a Tutorial

Thanks

Songotag



__________________
If i can help you...


Veteran Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 26
Date:

Today is a great day biggrin

 

Congratulations ecueditor producers
I hope I can get updates about sds v-strom, at this moment can not be read errors FI and misc information,no problem for  engine values.
I trust ecueditor and I proceeded in a small donation with PayPal confuse



-- Edited by dl650vstrom on Tuesday 9th of August 2011 08:10:21 PM

__________________


Veteran Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 26
Date:

problem solved




-- Edited by dl650vstrom on Wednesday 23rd of November 2011 08:29:43 AM

__________________


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 2338
Date:

could you check the following:
-pair is engine condition dependent (i.e. running or not, engine temp etc., please see sds manual for reqd conditions) and obviously will not function if its disabled
-dtc erase and visibility depends on debug mode on/off. without debug mode only active are visible at low rpm, with debug mode last dtc:s are visible





__________________

When asking a question, you can also consider posting it to facebook:

http://www.facebook.com/ecueditorcom



Veteran Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 26
Date:

other bugs vstrom:

engine tempature: wrong,the indicator is always low
RPM:real=900
ecueditor=2000

I hope in ecueditor update for v-strom



__________________


Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 22
Date:

dl650vstrom wrote:

other bugs vstrom:

engine tempature: wrong,the indicator is always low
RPM:real=900
ecueditor=2000

I hope in ecueditor update for v-strom


 Hello,

 

Can you tell me which interface did you use ?

thanks



__________________
If i can help you...


Veteran Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 26
Date:

Kkl vag com interface


__________________


Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 22
Date:

dl650vstrom wrote:

Kkl vag com interface


I've a KWP2000 do you think it can work ?

__________________
If i can help you...


Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 10
Date:

dl650vstrom wrote:

Bugs using kkl vag com 902 & ecueditor and Suzuki Diagnosis System:

1) ecueditor: no function pair on,pair off,reset ics,clear DTC,STP,active FI/DCT errorcode

2)SDS: [4007] interface box not connected



I think using the SDS software is going to take a bit more work.  Looking in the settings, there are a few options for baud rate.  This makes me believe that the SDS box is actually doing the KWP initialization. However, i thought a few pages back stated that data coming out of the computer was the same on the other side of the sds box, so if this is true then it may be possible to use the homemade cable. 

 

Also, where is the source code for ecueditor stored, I thought I remembered viewing some visual basic somewhere.  I can try to hunt down where the engine data isbeing skewed. 



__________________


Veteran Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 26
Date:

snoop wrote:
dl650vstrom wrote:

Bugs using kkl vag com 902 & ecueditor and Suzuki Diagnosis System:

1) ecueditor: no function pair on,pair off,reset ics,clear DTC,STP,active FI/DCT errorcode

2)SDS: [4007] interface box not connected



I think using the SDS software is going to take a bit more work.  Looking in the settings, there are a few options for baud rate.  This makes me believe that the SDS box is actually doing the KWP initialization. However, i thought a few pages back stated that data coming out of the computer was the same on the other side of the sds box, so if this is true then it may be possible to use the homemade cable. 

 

Also, where is the source code for ecueditor stored, I thought I remembered viewing some visual basic somewhere.  I can try to hunt down where the engine data isbeing skewed. 


 

ecueditor (metric mode engine) work fine with usb kkl vag com 409.1

SDS (error connection)

i think is a banal problem of drivers:

specifific drivers for Suzuki SDS are:PDIBUSB.INF and PDIBUSB.SYS but does not work with windows xp & vag com interface

 (



__________________


Veteran Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 26
Date:

Update ecueditor test:

Update test ecueditor v-strom 650 EU K5

FI error OK,i disconnect o2 sensor for test
debug ok
clear dtc ok
STP ok
pair ok
----------------------------------------------------------
Bugs:
RPM
engine temperature
IAT sensor ( i simulated 80 C with 330 ohm resistor)
C43 (do not exist)

Petrik,came in italy,you will be my guest :)






-- Edited by dl650vstrom on Wednesday 23rd of November 2011 08:31:31 AM

__________________


Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 10
Date:

The Suzuki driver shouldnt have anything to do with the vag com cable, I think one would have better luck trying to get an elm327 obd scanner to work with the sds software.  The SDS box is basically and obd scanner that can act independent of the software.  As it can be used on the bike for storing data while riding the bike.  Look at the chips inside of it on page 1 of this post.  



__________________


Veteran Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 26
Date:

I think you may be right :)

SDS protocol: iso 14230

vag com: iso9141,KWP2000

elm 327
ISO15765-4 (CAN)
ISO14230-4 (KWP2000)
ISO9141-2
J1850 VPW
J1850 PWM


__________________


Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 10
Date:

unfortunately I got a fake obd 2 scanner that says it has an elm327 chip in it however it was a copy that had a PIC chip in it.  So I was unable to get it to work.



__________________


Veteran Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 26
Date:

I hope not to buy a fake elm327
snoop,i send you a Private Message

__________________


Senior Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 196
Date:

snoop wrote:

unfortunately I got a fake obd 2 scanner that says it has an elm327 chip in it however it was a copy that had a PIC chip in it.  So I was unable to get it to work.


According to this datasheet the ELM has a PIC chip in it. It is based on the PIC design.
 http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=9&ved=0CFsQFjAI&url=http%3A%2F%2Felmelectronics.com%2FDSheets%2FELM323DS.pdf&rct=j&q=ISO14230-4%20(KWP2000)%20&ei=qgxZTuOgIM3ogQeb45ysDA&usg=AFQjCNHxrAzYDQG1Oc1ZkYMSfx-SVh7p4A&cad=rja


__________________


Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 10
Date:

I was unaware that the original ones used a PIC. There are real ones by this company http://www.elmelectronics.com/ and there are people out there who copy them and misprint the version on them. Getting a real one will guarantee the correct version.

__________________


Veteran Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 26
Date:

Can work fine this inferface with SDS (no ecueditor)?
V1.4 ELM327 OBDII OBD2 CAN-BUS Diagnostic Scanner USB

http://www.ebay.com/itm/V1-4-ELM327-OBDII-OBD2-CAN-BUS-Diagnostic-Scanner-USB-/270793597909?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f0c8e63d5


thanks

__________________


Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 10
Date:

Its tough to tell, a lot of those ebay listings are just copy and pasted from other listings. Some of the listings even list V1.4a and V1.5 which dont even exist. The fact that its come from hong kong definitely means its a clone, however it actually may have V1.4 on it. Its a gamble. Also, do not run any of the software on those disks, they are filled with viruses.

__________________


Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 10
Date:

Here is a link to the AT command sheet, you can see the version differences and the commands.  It looks version 1.3 and up support what we need.  See the KW keyword commands. http://www.sparkfun.com/datasheets/Widgets/ELM327_AT_Commands.pdf



__________________


Veteran Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 26
Date:

I tested elm 323 (support iso 9141/kwp2000 protocol)



-- Edited by dl650vstrom on Friday 2nd of September 2011 07:02:33 PM



-- Edited by dl650vstrom on Wednesday 23rd of November 2011 08:34:13 AM

__________________


Veteran Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 26
Date:

I may have a problem with drivers (elm 323)
there is no difference between:
http://www.ftdichip.com/Drivers/VCP.htm
http://www.ftdichip.com/Drivers/D2XX.htm
Virtual COM Port Drivers http://www.ftdichip.com/Drivers/CDM/CDM20814_WHQL_Certified.zip
D2XX Direct Drivers        http://www.ftdichip.com/Drivers/CDM/CDM20814_WHQL_Certified.zip
are identical!!!I do not understand


 



-- Edited by dl650vstrom on Sunday 4th of September 2011 07:15:32 AM



-- Edited by dl650vstrom on Wednesday 23rd of November 2011 08:49:35 AM

__________________


Veteran Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 80
Date:

for what it's worth, I configured my propeller to talk to the SDL/K-line on my SV1000 ECU, and
started sending the command to dump the sensor values (readDataByLocalIdentifier) ...
I varied each of the sensor inputs independently and noted which byte in the output stream changed value,
and here's what I got:

propeller --> ECU: 80 12 F1 02 21 08 AE
ECU --> propeller:

1-80 header/format
2-F1 header/destination
3-12 header/source
4-34 #bytes of data
5-61 response type (dump of sensor data)
6-08 
7-13
8-16
9-50
10-E0
11-01
12-05
13-A2
14-FF
15-FF
16-FF
17-FF
18-00
19-00
20-00 <-- throttle position
21-FF <-- IAP1
22-00 <-- ECT engine coolant temp
23-00 <-- IAT intake air temp
24-FF
25-00
26-FF
27-00
28-FF <-- IAP2
29-FF
30-FF
31-FF
32-00
33-00
34-00
35-00
36-FF
37-FF
38-FF
39-FF
40-FF
41-FF
42-40
43-40
44-FF
45-FF
46-FF
47-00 <-- STP secondary throttle pos
48-FF
49-FF
50-FF
51-FF
52-00
53-00 <-- clutch position
54-40 <-- neutral
55-FF
56-FF
57-C7 <-- checksum

 it appears that the locations of the sensor data is very similar (if not identical) to other Suzukis


I am yet to hook up my CKPS generator and find where the RPM lives

cheers,
Mark



-- Edited by bozo on Saturday 5th of November 2011 12:32:09 PM

__________________


Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 13
Date:

visit this link, Russian member of this forum were run kkl vag-com 409.1 FT232 and LM339 voltage converter is
http://www.gsxrclub.ru/index.php?topic=18348.120

__________________


Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 22
Date:

Hello guys, do you thinks this interface can work for my v strom ?

here



__________________
If i can help you...


Veteran Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 26
Date:

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Arduino-USB-6Pin-Serial-Port-USB-Adapter-Download-Cable-FT232RL-Chip-/320788621152?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4ab07de760&clk_rvr_id=287371010506

FT232RL adapter + transistor/resistor interface?



-- Edited by dl650vstrom on Wednesday 23rd of November 2011 08:55:08 AM

__________________
«First  <  1 2 3 4 5  >  Last»  | Page of 5  sorted by
 
Quick Reply

Please log in to post quick replies.

Tweet this page Post to Digg Post to Del.icio.us


Create your own FREE Forum
Report Abuse
Powered by ActiveBoard